PRs oppose Anti Corruption Commission [1]
Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 19:34. Updated on Monday, September 9, 2013 - 18:40.
From the House, an English translation summary from the Tongan vernacular, by Pesi Fonua.
Tonga Legislative Assembly, Minute No. 7, Tuesday, June 16, 2009.
Highlights:
- Noble Lasike pleaded with the Prime Minister for licenses to export sea cucumber. The PM said he heard the cry and they would meet to see what they could do.
- Concern over the pandemic swine flu, particularly with the hundreds of overseas Tongans who were coming for the Wesleyan Church annual conference.
- PR Clive Edwards expresses concern over the practice of foreign aid donors' topping-up the salary of civil servants without letting government knows the top-up amount.
- Clive queries the Royal Judicial Commission salaries and asks which vote were they going to be paid from?
- The House argues over the meaning of "Contingency Fund" and what it could be spent on.
- 'Akilisi calls for the termination of the Anti Corruption Commission because he believes it won't work.
- The Minister of Tourism, Hon. Fineasi Funaki, says that 'Akilisi should wear a woman's skirt, and calls him a hypocrite, claiming that he burned Nuku'alofa down and then took a false oath in court.
-The Minister of Communication objects and says it was not right to say that they were talking like women.
Hoped members were coming
The Acting Speaker, Noble Tu'iha'angana led the House in singing the Lord's Prayer.
The Clerk made the roll call. He said that the Ministers of Education, the Minister for Youth and Sports, the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries, were on leave of absence, Noble Vaha'i was away overseas, and those who did not answer their calls he hoped they were coming late.
Sea cucumber
Noble's Representative Lasike reminded the Prime Minister about his request for the lifting of the restriction on the number of licenses for the export of sea cucumber. He said that there had been no definite response from the Ministry of Fisheries but he had been called numerous times by people wanting to know if they would be able to export sea cucumber this year.
The Prime Minister Hon. Dr Feleit Sevele, said that the Minister concerned was away sick, and they would need time to discuss the matter before making a decision.
Swine flu alert
People's Representative Sunia Fili proposed for the public alert about the Swine Flu to be incorporated into the existing Emergency Act.
PR 'Akilisi Pohiva wanted to know if the Ministry of Health hade got a plan in place in case of a Swine Flu outbreak during the annual conference of the Free Wesleyan Church of Tonga, in June, which would bring into the country hundreds of overseas Tongans.
The Minister of Health, Dr Viliami Tangi, said that the Swine Flu, had been rated by the WHO to have reached a pandemic state, but so far there had not been any global movement to stop international flights. He said that they have been running a daily radio program for schools, informing children on how to take precaution. He appreciated the concerned expressed by Sunia Fili, but to enact a law to stop the coming of international flights and the landing of cruise ships would have a negative impact on tourism and foreign relations. He advised that whenever anyone felt sick he or she should stay home and get better.
PR Teisina Fuko suggested that they should stop the conference.
The Minister of Health said that people who were coming for the conference would be staying in community halls and the Queen Salote College dormitories, and if someone was identified with the flu the whole compound would be closed down. He gave the House the latest statistics on Swine Flu.
Budget
The House dissolved the Legislature into Committee and the Chairman PR Samiu Vaipulu, took his chair.
PR Clive Edwards expressed his concern over the big difference in the original estimate for the government collection from consumption tax, which was $64.3 million but a revised estimate showed they collected only $33.2 million.
The Minister of Finance, 'Afu'alo Matoto, reminded the member that the matter was addressed the week before, and there were some irregularities with the $33.2 million figure, and at the moment that figure had gone up to $50 million. He said that $46 million from income tax included some consumption tax figures because the Customs also collected CT and some was collected by the Income Tax Department.
Clive reminded the Minister of his concern about how foreign aid donors, who topped up the salaries of foreign workers, did not want to reveal the top up figures, and claimed "they want to operate in secret." He did not think it was a good approach for the Tongan government to entertain.
The Minister of Finance apologized for the error in his consumption tax figures, but he pointed that the rest of the table was correct.
With regards to Clive's concern about the secrecy over top-up salaries, he repeated what he told them the day before that the practice was dying out and confidentiality between aid donors and government was improving.
NZ aid
PR Sunia Fili reported on an article in the New Zealand Dominion Post with a comment by the NZ Foreign Minister who said that NZ aid money for the reconstruction of Nuku'alofa and a fumigation machine for the airport went "Missing in Action".
The Minister of Finance said the member misinterpreted the news.
Clive said that the New Zealand Foreign Minister was very wrong, because all NZ foreign aid programs in Tonga were monitored by the New Zealand High Commission in Nuku'alofa.
Town officers
Sunia apologized for his obvious misinterpretation of the news. Anyway, going back to the budget he suggested that if a town or district officer left their town or district on community duty there should be an acting position and a salary.
The Minister of Finance said that if the officer was traveling within Tonga he should be given a travel allowance. If he was going overseas on a community project, he should still be receiving his salary, but if he was directed by the community to travel on a community project then the expenses should be paid by the community.
The Deputy Prime Minister, Dr Viliami Tangi, reminded the House that the traveling allowances for Town and District officers was catered for in the votes of the two Governors.
Judicial Review Commission
PR 'Isileli Pulu raised his concern that there was an initiative not to have any cabinet ministers as directors in statutory boards, but there were still ministers in boards. He also pointed out that there had not been any annual report from the Water Board, and he wanted to know what had the judiciary done wrong that warranted the formation of the Judicial Review Commission.
The Minister of Finance explained that the reduction of the number of Cabinet Ministers in statutory boards was ongoing and they had taken out ministers from five boards. With regards to the Judicial Review Commission he said that the commission should not have been under the vote of the PM's office because the commission was under the control of the Chief Justice, the Judiciary, and the Law Society, and they were responsible for the appointing of new judges and other judicial duties.
The Deputy Prime Minister reminded 'Isileli that the Judicial Review commission was formed after the House passed a legislation legalizing its formation.
Clive wanted to know why the Commission was under the vote of the PM's Office. He thought it was unconstitutional.
The Deputy PM, reminded the member that he had already asked that question a few days ago, and it was agreed on that the Acting Minister of Justice would work on it then come back with an answer.
The Minister of Finance also reminded the member that he had already explained that the Commission should not have been under the PM's Office.
Not in budget
The Chairman directed for the Law Reform Committee and the Judicial Review Commission to be moved from the vote of the PM to the Judiciary.
Clive wanted to know which vote the Royal Judicial Commission that is chaired by Dalgety was under.
The Minister of Justice said that the question was asked and answered last night. The answer was that it was not under any vote, and there is no fund for it under the budget.
Clive thought it was not proper for the Chairman inspect courthouses when the commission had not got a budget. He said there was a rumour that a commissioner was paid $1,800 per day.
Contingency Fund
The Minister of Finance said there was no allocation in the budget for the commission but if there was a need then it would be most appropriate to be paid out of the Contingency Fund.
Clive argued that Contingency Fund was for emergency needs, not something that had been established without any allocation.
The Minister of Finance insisted the Contingency Fund was to meet unexpected needs of government.
'Akilisi proposed that they should kill the Royal Judicial Commission, because there had been complaints about the commission inquiring into some of the decisions passed by the court. He suspected that someone was trying to interfere with the courts.
Teisina did not think it was proper to use the Contingency Fund to meet the expenses of the Royal Judicial Commission.
The Minister did not think the member understood what the Contingency Fund was for, and above all it was a fund that was approved by the House for government to spend.
PM's Office
PR 'Etuate Lavulavu made a general comment about the PM's Office and how it was managing aid programs for Tonga. He said that all this money could be useful if the House supported the PM and the work he was doing.
'Akilisi did not think it was proper for 'Etuate to tell them about the PM's Office, they already knew.
The two members had a bit of ping-pong for a while. 'Akilisi said he did not want to hear 'Etuate's speech, then 'Etuate told him to close his ears.
The Vote of the Prime Minister's Office was passed and the committee proceeded to Vote no. 4, the vote for the Anti Corruption Commission.
Anti Corruption Commission
The Minister of Finance told the House that the Public Relations Commission was merging with the Anti Corruption Commission.
'Isileli wondered why the Anti Corruption Commission had not been up and running. Why did it not have a budget?
The Minister told the member that the Commission had a budget, and there was an acting Commissioner who had left, but with the new Attorney General and the Judicial Review Committee they should be able to identify a Commissioner.
Opposition
'Akilisi proposed for the Anti Corruption Commission to be temporarily terminated.
The chairman told the member that he could not do things like that without amending the law.
'Akilisi said that nothing had been done, and asked what was the use to the country spending money on this commission.
The Minister of Finance told the member that the Anti Corruption Commission had not even started working yet. The Law was passed in 2007 and an acting commissioner was appointed last year, but he had left.
'Isileli thought it was a waste of money to establish the Anti Corruption Commission.
'Akilisi said such a commission would not work unless there was change to the system of government, and no one would like to come from overseas and work for such a commission.
New system
The Minister of Finance reminded the member that in a new system of government the commission would be working a lot harder.
The Minister for Tourism wondered if 'Akilisi could tell him the ideal system of government where such a commission would work, and a foreigner could work.
'Akilisi said that a commissioner would never be able to fulfill his duty. He would just get paid and spend most of his time at Nuku'alofa Club.
'Etuate told 'Akilisi he had been in the House for 23 years, why did he not draft a Bill to correct what he thought was not right with the Anti Corruption Commission Act.
Clive did not think Tonga needed an Anti Corruption Commission "because we are not talking about the illegal transference of millions of millions of dollars . . . the little cases here, everyone knows about it." He said we are trying to make ourselves look good but meanwhile spending an awful lot of money.
About turn
The Minister of Works wanted clarification because the establishment of the Anti Corruption Commission was in response to suggestion and pressure from the PRs, but what he was hearing today was the opposite, so there maybe a need to reassess the situation.
The Chairman said "let's declare that we have passed Vote No. 4. No. 5, the Auditor General."
'Akilisi with regards to the Auditor General, wanted to know why the PM refused to release the Auditor General's report on Hon. Fineasi Funaki.
'Etuate said that the House threw out a motion for an impeachment of the Hon. Fineasi Funaki, so he did not think it was proper for the House to discuss the same issue.
The Deputy PM said that the member was just wasting the House's time over matter that they had already dealt with and he just liked wasting time.
The Chairman told the member that if he wanted a copy of the report he should ask the speaker of the House, not the PM.
The Minister for Tourism, said that 'Akilisi deliberately dragged the House to areas where they ended up "behaving like old women". He told 'Akilisi to go and wear a woman's skirt.
'Akilisi said the member was angry.
The Chairman said who wouldn't be, the way he was carrying on.
'Akilisi said that the House was facing a very difficult time with cases like this.
The Minister for Tourism said that it was more difficult after he set fire to central Nuku'alofa then he took a false oath in Court.
Not right
The Minister of Communication reminded the House that the discussion was between men, and it was not right to say that they were talking like women.
'Isileli said there was a lot of issues they wanted to discuss about the Auditor's General report on Hon. Fineasi Funaki.
Hon. Fineasi Funaki said if they wanted to talk about that he also would like to ask them how they planned the destruction of Nuku'alofa, then afterwards they went and took false oaths in Court.
The Minister for Youth and Sport proposed that they should have a break.
The House was closed until 6 pm.