From the House, an English translation summary from the Tongan vernacular, by Pesi Fonua.

Tonga Legislative Assembly, Minute No. 4, Tuesday night, 23 June 2009.

Highlights:

- 'Akilisi Pohiva called to stop TV Tonga from broadcasting extracts from proceedings of the House.

- Government to borrow $92 million from China to stimulate the economy by building roads and assisting small businesses.

- The House approves for Cabinet Ministers to have a new salary scale.

- The House argues over the fact that the PRs and Nobles' Representatives rejected Salway's proposed salary scale when it was presented to the House in 2006, but it was welcomed by Cabinet ministers.

- PRs, in an about turn, plead for Cabinet Ministers and elected members of the House to agree to accept Salway's report and keep the public happy.

Probably coming late

The clerk told the Speaker that those who did not answer their calls were probably coming late.

Budget debate continues

The Speaker, Hon. Tu'iha'angana, said that they had six votes to go, and there were also three more Motion/Resolutions to be debated in committee.

People's Representative 'Akilisi Pohiva called on the Prime Minister to stop the broadcasting on Television Tonga of extracts from debate in the House. He was referring to an interview of the Minister for Communication about the opposition by 'Akilisi and 'Isileli Pulu to a civil society group, which is going around the villages and explaining the interim report of the Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission. He said that instead of broadcasting extracts they should present the whole debate in the House on the issue.

The Speaker reminded the PR that there is media freedom, and any members of the House could be interviewed. He said that starting soon, a two hours program of the House would be broadcast on Friday and Saturday evenings.

The Speaker dissolved the Legislature and the chairman of the committee, Samiu Vaipulu took his chair. He declared that Vote No. 17 was passed.

Government borrowing

Noble Lasike wanted to know if businesses in Nuku'alofa that were not affected by the burning of Nuku'alofa in 2006 would be able to borrow from the $92 million that the Tonga Government was going to borrow from the Bank of China. He supported the Motion/Resolution that had been presented to the House to allow government to borrow from the Bank of China.

The Minister of Finance, Hon. Afu'alo Matoto, told the House that the proposed loan from China was for the construction of roads throughout Tonga and to address the current global economic crisis. If there were businesses or an industry that need to be assisted would be assisted. He said that he could not tell the House the terms and conditions of the loan because they had not started negotiating the loan.

PR 'Isilei Pulu said that the proposed loan was the worst that he had ever known since he entered parliament, because there was no information on the exact amount and the name of the bank they were going to borrow from.

The Minister of Finance, reminded the member that he had just explained that he could not give any details because they had not started negotiating.

The Minister of Tourism, Hon. Fineasi Funaki, told 'Isileli to stop wasting the time of the House. The government's first big loan from China of $118 million was for the reconstruction of Nuku'alofa after it was burned down, and the purpose for this proposed loan of $92 million was to stimulate the economy because of the current global financial crisis.

'Isileli expressed a feeling of an inferior complex because the Minister seemed to think he was lazy and not doing any work.

The Minister said he was just trying to speed up the process because the public was waiting for this most useful loan, that the member had labeled as a waste of time.

'Isileli argued that he never said that the loan was a waste of time. He said that any normal person would not proceed with such a loan without more details.

The Minister of Finance repeated what he told the member earlier, and pointed out to the member that there were many ways to negotiate a loan.

Sea Cucumbers

Noble Lasike returned to the issue of Sea Cucumbers once more and pleaded with the Minister of Agriculture and Fisheries, Prince Tu'ipelehake, to issue more licenses to export Sea Cucumber and to increase the 2009 season quota by 200 tonnes.

The Minister of Agriculture and Fisheries, Prince Tu'ipelehake, said that the ministry hads a policy and its objective was for Tonga to be able to have a sustainable Sea Cucumber exporting industry. He said that the exporters were not infringing the quota system, but the local people, because there was no limitation on the quantity that they can harvest.

He said that the restriction on the number of license holders and the quota was to be in line with Tonga's commitment to an international agreement. The Minister, however, said that he heard the crying and the pleading of members for licenses.

Exceptions to rules

He related a story that was told by Clive Edwards when he was the Minister of Police and in charge of immigration. A Chinese man had been trying to get a Tongan visa for his mother to come to Tonga, but he was repeatedly turned down. In a last and final attempt the man asked the Minister if he had a mother. The moral of the story was that the man got the visa for his mother. The Minister said that the policy of his ministry was clear, he would reassess the situation, with the objective remaining to be a sustainable Sea Cucumber industry for Tonga.

The members who had been pleading for licenses for weeks, Noble Lasike, Sione Teisina Fuko and 'Etuate Lavulavu were very pleased with the response from the Prince and were praising him for wisdom and caring for the people.

Road construction

PR Teisina Fuko, with regards to the Motion/Resolution for Tonga to borrow $92 million from China, he wondered if the Minister could give the House a break down of the objective of the loan.

The Minister said that $60 million will be for road construction, $37 million for Tongatapu, $10 million for Vava'u, $5 million for Ha'apai, $5 million for 'Eua and $3 million for the two Niuas. The remaining $32 million would be used to stimulate economic growth.

Teisina said that they had been waiting for an economic stimulus package and this loan was what the country had been waiting for. He moved that they should pass the Motion/Resolution.

PR 'Etuate Lavulavu, proposed for the formula to be the other way around, $32 million for road construction and $60 million to businesses that generate revenues and create jobs. He also wanted to know how much was left for Tonga to repay China for all its existing loans, for the Ha'apai and the Tonga High schools.

Other loans

The Minister of Finance said that Tonga High School was not a loan and the loan for the Ha'apai High School was interest free and the only loan that had been partially repaid was for the Janfull International Hotel, $3 million had been repaid.

'Isileli expressed his concern with the increasing number of government loans, particularly since there were small loans that have not been repaid.

'Etuate said that because 'Isileli did not appear to be supportive of the $92 million loan, he suggested that they should cancel the allocation for Tongatapu, and the people of Tongatapu because 'Isileli opposed the loan.

'Isileli disagreed with the member, and that he was just making a contribution to the debate.

The Minister of Tourism, told 'Isileli that they were spending a long time discussing the proposed loan because of efforts to burn down Nuku'alofa and then he got away with it by lying under oath in court.

Big loan

The Minister of Finance told the House that the government's total loan amounted to $230 million or 34% of GDP. With the proposed loan $92 million plus the $118 million for the reconstruction of Nuku'alofa the percentage would be just over 50%, but if there was no other big government loan the percentage should be 40% of the GDP.

'Isileli queried why the road near the area where he lived had not been fixed, yet roads else where had been fixed, including 'Eua. They have petitioned for their road to be fixed and he thought it was unfair that a road that runs near a property of the Prime Minister had been tar-sealed but it stopped before it got to their area.

The Minister of Works, Hon. Nuku, said that road construction was based on survey and where the needs were very urgent. The road that the member referred to that had been tar-sealed near his area was a request from the New Zealand government because it ran by the High Commission's residence.

The people of 'Eua petitioned and their road was built because it was discovered that their needs were very urgent. With regards to the member's road they had decided to leave it awaiting the loan from China that they were discussing.

The chairman declared that they had passed Vote 18 and for the proceeding to continue with Vote 19.

Education funding

PR Teisina Fuko said he noticed that the University of the South Pacific was no longer offering courses in Tonga, but the government's Vocational Schools and Community Colleges were very popular with school leavers, he suggested for Government to pump more money into this area of skill training.

'Etuate wanted to know why the $1 million for technical and vocational training was given to the Ministry of Education instead of the Ministry of Youth and Sports, which is responsible for technical and vocational training.

Rugby administration

He also expressed his concern over the status of the Tonga Rugby Union, which had brought shame to the country. He suggested it should come under the control of the Ministry of Sports.

The Minister of Labour, Commerce and Industries, Hon. Lisiate 'Akolo, said that he heard in the news in the morning that the 'Ikale Tahi was threatening to go on strike because they had not been paid. He said that if they went on strike in Fiji during the Pacific Nations' Cup it would be such a shame. He suggested for government to get involved in the preparation of the 'Ikale Tahi for its first game of the 2011 rugby world cup against the New Zealand All Blacks.

The Minister of Finance told 'Etuate that the reason why the $1 million for technical and vocational training had to go through the vote of the Ministry of Education was for the sake of keeping all the funding for educational projects in one place.

'Etuate suggested that if that was the idea than they should terminate the Ministry for Youth and Sports, but the Minister of Education said that 'Etuate was making silly comments.

Beat the All Blacks

Teisina with regards to the 2011 Rugby World Cup and Tonga's opening game with the All Blacks he suggested for Tonga to set a target to beat the All Blacks. He said that a plan to achieve such an aim should become an economic stimulus for Tonga. He suggested for government to secure some funding for that project.

He told the House that the Fijian parliament had allocated $3 million for the preparation of their team for the 2011 World Cup.

The Minister for Youth and Sports, Hon. Tu'ivakano, did not think it was a good idea for rugby to come under his ministry, but because rugby is a national sport and the rugby union should be encouraged to shape up. He said that the union in the past asked for financial assistance from the House, but the problem had been that there had not been any financial report.

Tonga Rugby Union

PR Clive Edwards did not think that government could solve the problem of the Tongan Rugby Union. He said that during the past years the Court hads been trying but to no avail. He said that the problem was because many people were getting involved in rugby to make a living, instead of getting involved to develop rugby. There was just too much politics in rugby.
He said that Tonga had been deprived of financial assistance from the International Rugby Board, which could have come in to develop rugby. During the past four or five years the IRB had not received any financial report, and so they no longer send their financial contribution for the development of rugby in Tonga. He said that the current problem with the 'Ikale Tahi was because there were three players who were stirring up trouble within the team, and those three should be dismissed from the team.

Justice Ministry

The Committee had a short break and when they returned they switched and starting discussing the Vote of the Ministry of Justice.

Teisina expressed his concern over a sudden drop in the allocation for salaries, and because of the low salaries most young lawyers were leaving the ministry.

'Isileli wanted to know the name of the lawyer who was paid by government when the Prime Minister sued Mana Fatulisi.

The Acting Minister of Justice, Hon. 'Eseta Fusitu'a, thought the question was inappropriate since they were discussing the budget, and such questions should be raised when they discussed the annual report of her ministry. She thought it was a waste of overtime payment to discuss such matters unrelated to the budget. She told the member to come around to the Prime Minister's Office at 8.30 am in the morning so that they could find out the answer to his questions.

The Chairman asked the committee to consider that they had approved Vote No. 20, and for the proceedings to continue with Vote No. 21, Public Enterprises.

Communications minister

Vote 21 was declared passed and they moved on to Vote No. 22, the Ministry of Communication and Public Information.

'Akilisi called on the Prime Minister to replace the new Minister of Communication. He repeated what he raised in the House in the morning about a news item on TV Tonga when the Minister was interviewed about resistance by 'Akilisi and 'Isileli about the work of a Civil Society group who were going around the villages explaining to the people the interim report of the Commission for Political Reform.

The Prime Minister said that the member was unreasonable and he seemed to think he was the only one who could point out the wrong of others and no one could do the same to him.

'Akilisi said that the Minister was wrong when she said that he and 'Isileli thought that the Civil Society Group would mislead the people. The task should be of the Commission.

The Prime Minister reminded 'Akilisi that he had already told him in the House that the Commission for Political Reform had made a written statement that it was not their task to explain their report to the people.

The Chairman declared for the committee to consider that they have already passed Vote No. 23.

He called for vote on the government budget for 2009-10. It was carried 19-0.

Motions

The Clerk read Motion/Resolution No. 1, for 2009 for government to pay the salary of Justice Robert Shuster, $350,000 annually and any irregularities in the exchange rate.

The chairman called for votes, it was carried, 19-0.

The Clerk read Motion/Resolution No. 2, 2009 for Parliament to allow government to borrow $92 million from the China Exim Bank.

The Chairman called for votes, it was carried 19-0.

The Chairman called on the Clerk to read a Motion/Resolution by 'Etuate Lavulavu.

The Clerk read the Motion/Resolution No. 3, 2009, proposing for the Finance Committee of the House to draft a plan for financial assistance to existing businesses that are facing financial problems with the banks. Including in the businesses to be covered are those in tourism, agriculture, fisheries, and businesses in the private sector, which are bringing in foreign earnings.

(This motion was not dealt with and at the end of proceedings Noble Tu'iha'angana proposed for the Motion/Resolution of 'Etuate Lavulavu to be deferred for later date.)

The Chairman called on the clerk to read Motion/Resolution No. 4.

The Clerk read Motion/Resolution No. 4 from the Tongan Parliament in response to a Privy Council decision No. 144 of September 16, 2008 for the annual salaries of Cabinet Ministers to be as follows:
Prime Minister $90,000, Deputy Prime Minister $83,000, Minister of Finance $83,000, the rest of the Ministers $80,000 and the Governor $75,000.

The Minister would earn only one set of salaries, a combination of their ministerial salaries, their basic salary from the House and their daily allowance. If the Motion/Resolution was passed Minister would no longer received their daily allowance, their basic salary and overtime payment from the House, starting in July 2009.

'Akilisi wanted to know why were they dealing only with the salaries of the Ministers and not all the members of the House.

The Minister for Youth and Sports pointed out that when the matter was raised before they, the Ministers were told to abide by Salway's salary scale, while elected members abided by the 60, 70, 80% salary rise that was proposed by 'Akilisi and 'Uliti. So the Ministers were still abiding by the salary scale proposed by Salway.

'Akilisi reckoned that they should go with Salway's scale.

Clive suggested that the salaries of the ministers and the elected members should remain as they were until the reform, rather than change now and then change again later. He was concerned that the taxing of members' allowances 20% made a devastating impact on their salaries.

'Akilisi insisted that all the salaries of members of the House should be in accordance with Salway's proposed salary scale.

The Deputy Prime Minister, Hon. Viliami Tangi, reminded the members that it had been a concern for some time the fact that the House decided its own salary. Then finally they agreed to bring in an independent person to assess and set the salaries. A foreigner, Salway came and access all their earnings, allowances, overtime, weekly allowance, and national tours.

He said that Salway's proposed salary scale for elected members and Cabinet Ministers was presented to the House. It was accepted by the Cabinet but the others wanted it to go to the Finance Committee. When the Report was returned from the Finance Committee it was different from Salway's proposal, and the salaries of elected members were higher.

The Minister of Works told the House that when Salway's report was presented to the Finance Committee (in 2006), it was decided to submit it to a sub-committee chaired by 'Uliti Uata and 'Akilisi Pohiva. They rejected Salway's figures presented their own figures, which were higher than Salway's.

Noble Tu'iha'angana gave a run down of Salway's figures: Speaker $56,000, and the members $58,000 or $48,000. The fees for committee meeting was only $30 per meeting.

Teisina supported Clive for the salary of all members of parliament to remain until after the reform in 2010. He asked where he got the 160% salary rise that he had been telling people.

'Akilisi denied that it was not him who was telling people that the Privy Council had approved a 160% salary rise for Cabinet ministers.

'Akilisi pleaded for the House to agree that their salaries would be abide with what was proposed by Salway, he said that when the people heard that they would be happy, instead of stating that the Cabinet Ministers, were abiding by Salway, and the PRs weren't.

The Minister of Works proposed for the House to vote and passed the Motion/Resolution on their salaries, because they agreed to it right from the beginning. Once it was passed it would set a direction for the PRs and Nobles Representatives to follow.

Noble Tu'iha'angana proposed for the committee to vote on the Motion/Resolution for the salaries of Cabinet Ministers, so that they could proceed with theirs. With regards to the salaries of the rest of the members of the House it should go back to the Finance Committee.

The Chairman called for votes. It was carried 19-0.

The Committee was dissolved into Legislature and the Speaker took his chair.

Passed

The Speaker called for votes on Bill No. 2 2009 to amend the Constitution. It was carried 14-0.

The Speaker called for the second reading of Bill No. 1, for the Appropriation Act 2009. It was carried 19-0.

The Speaker called for the third reading of Bill No. 1 2009. It was carried 20-0, and the Speaker gave it his signature.

He called for votes on the Motion/Resolution No. 1 for government to pay the salary of Justice Robert Shuster. It was carried 19-0.

He called for votes on Motion/resolution No. 2 for a $92 million loan from China. It was carried 18-0.

He called for votes on Motion/Resolution No. 4 on the new salary scales for Cabinet Ministers. It was carried 20-0.

Meeting over PRs salaries

'Akilisi moved for PRs and Noble's representatives in the finance committee, with Clive Edwards to look at Salway's report, then present it to the House on Monday to be passed.

Teisina suggested for all elected members to be at the meeting and have the right to vote. A decision from this meeting was to be presented to a meeting by the House on Monday, June 29.

The Speaker called for votes. It was carried 19-1. Against was Clive Edwards.

The House closed until 9.30 am Monday June 29.